my uncle has just been diagnosed as having diabetes mellitus. i don't know much about the disorder. how is the medication insulin produced? by bacteria in big vats are there bacteria that naturally produce insulin, or are they genetically engineered? Biccers what made you wanna get it? they're genetically engineered hmm.. Neat! You wouldn't want those rascals floating around in your body... Not without a healthy supply of pure sugar on hand. they splice the gene into a few hundred.. and within hours a zillion have been produced with the gene exactly.. hence the large vats they keep them in and it's common bacteria found in the body.. don't remember exactly which one though e colis? no they're rather safe They're always messing with that one. scary.. those would kill you dead. I don't think so different bacteria Biccers what made you wanna get the Bear's Guide? nice harmless one Insulin can screw you up. well this is how they make it for commercial use rather than slaughtering pigs for it <[mra]> is there like a guiness record for most college credit hours with an actual degree? I hear they can also make Orange Juice the same way.. >glorio> the "Most college credit hours without a degree" is probably higher <[mra]> with no. <[mra]> actual. degree. <[mra]> yeah, thats what i meant :), glorio A vat full of the Pulp Cells. lol I doubt that no Peel No tree. I'm Serious. Ooops... I meant Vanilla. Not OJ.. (OJ was a hypothetical example) "The Biotech Century" <- Great Book. vanilla I buy.. OJ? no but i thought that insulin was a hormone produced by pancreas cells that causes the metabolism of carbohydrates in other cells... does the bacteria simulate the pancreas? no.. they splice the gene for making insulin into the bacteria that is unaffected by insulin they keep the bacteria in a vat.. where it lives happily munching on sugar and producing insulin.. which they remove from the vat it's like a honey comb sortof Sweet.. must have made someone very Rich! yep previous to this technology.. the only way to get human compatible insulin was to remove it from a pig pancreas so the bacteria IS simulating the pancreas, which normally produces the insulin in the human body? this was very very hard.. and very very expensive why only pigs? It's not Simulating the pancreas... it produces Insulin as a waste product I'd imagine? no.. the bacteria itself produces insulin.. which the scientists bottle and said person with diabetes injects into themselves right... it contains the gene for insulin but has no use for it itself so discards it there are no actual bacteria in the pancreas not a healthy one. yes, so does the pancreas produce insulin. so from that stand point, you can say that the bacteria is simulating the pancreas. they used pigs because the tissue type of a pig is close enough to a humans that it greatly reduces the risk of rejection A pancreas produces insulin, but it Acts to keep the balance of blood sugar... so in that respect the bacteria are not doing what the pancreas does. which must have made strict Muslim and Jewish diabetics very unhappy nod I don't think they're allowed to eat bacteria either... ;) alright.. diabetes is a disease where the pancreas no longer produces insulin you use bacteria in vats to produce insulin heck, it'll speed up their trip to the wonderful afterlife they deserve why is the tisue an issue? it would not be the tisue which is injected into the patient? is the etiology of diabetes completely understood yet? the patient checks their blood sugar and determines if insulin is needed to regulate it glorio: some forms of diabetes yes.. some no i know they killed a lot of dogs trying to identify insulin. nod The Muslims? ;) pigs have alot of the same tissue type.. hence alot of the same dna.. their insulin is close to the human insulin.. if it were too different.. there would be massive rejection.. like giving A type blood to someone with B type i wonder why we couldn't splice insulin producing cells in our own bodies. hmm... then the insulin production would go unchecked... then you'd die. better to leave it to the pros. nod well, i thought of that, but the concept would be that it can be regulated. the genes already exist.. along with the regulation mechanism diabetes is where something goes haywire.. either with the genes themselves.. or the pancreatic tissue those shots are a bitch. especially for kids/ i also know that the two people that were working on finding a cure for diabetes had a fist fight in the lab when they discovered insulin. they each wanted the credit and riches that came along. that's sad No shit? it shows you that idiots can figure this stuff out. or that ppl with good brains can still act like animals they're working on a virus form of the genes.. that will splice working genes back into the pancreatic tissue for the type of diabetes most often found in children.. I heard something similar happened... Turns out madam Curie and Mister Curie were secretly putting Radium in eachothers late night coffee... Killed em both.. Sad what fame can do to a couple... actually pierre curie was hit by a carriage and killed while crossing the road Ah well... Just as well... (ah the things I learned in chem this semester) Will do CoCheese. dibose, but he was dying already of radiation at the time. yes he was :) as was she but he was hit by a carriage while she was not :) the rumour mill never sleeps Radium Killed her. yep It was driving a carriage... what a horrible death hmmm Why did Pierre Curie cross the road? because I could not stop for death he kindly stopped for me why is aids so difficult to crack? he didnt because it's a retrovirus which essentially means it's a piece of rna that reverse transcriptases itself into dna inside a cell it mutates quickly To get run over by a carriage loaded full of Radium? It was radium that killed em both. and it also hides in the immune cells it puts itself in the dna??! wow yep how can it do that? I thought rna could only read and then that dna instructs the cell to take apart the rest of the dna and rebuild it into more of the HIV virus ugh, bio too long ago dna is copied onto rna right what does that again? but how does that differ from a non retrovirus? a retrovirus contains a chemical called reverse transcriptase which basically reverses that process producing dna it's got an enzyme with it? nod cool virus's are a great argument for evolution virii that is hehe what do you mean by "which basically reverses that process producing dna"? Argument? now a regular virus... one with just dna.. has to turn the dna into rna to replicate itself ugh grammar fails at this hour Anyone Ever heard of Regents College? yes, and only bad things :) ugh.. Really? University of the State of New York? No, not really. it takes the ATGC from the dna of the cell.. and matches it to the AUGC of the rna.. and produces the virus dna at a very rapid pace Don't tease me like that...;/ why, are you going there, loser? :) what dibosa? so now you have dna, but i thought the virus was rna? isnt virus dna unique to the virus? as in, how is it that all dna of all virii are just augcaugc etc.? it is all your dna is ATGC well then what?! is that an enumeration or a pattern? it's adenine guanine thyacine and cytocine first, is hiv dna or rna? it's a pattern right but.. hiv is rna the A's match up to the T's and the C's match up to the G's I thought that a and t and g and c occured in certain mostly inconsecutive ways now, it uses this rna to instruct the cell to splice itself as dna into the cells chromosomes, right? right, I know yes ok... thyacine is replaced by uracil, right? in rna? yep :) Nothing like the smell of RNA in the morning... that's what I always say... how is any information stored in a piece of dna that just says atgc over and over again? so what is this about being retro? arent there some gcat places? now once the dna is in the cell.. that strand of dna instructs the cell to take it's dna apart essentially.. breaking it into components (ATGC) and using those components to make multiple components of the virus wait I mean... arent there some places where it is gcgc or atat yes so its not always atgc That was a silly question...it's like saying how does 1 and 0 make all these letters and stuff.... it was just an example.. i meant that all the cells use the same essential components atgc oh sorry G A T T A C A I thought you meant that was the way it all ran :) no :) is that an enumeration or a pattern? I've got a question??? :) sorry (sheepish look) it's a pattern in my mind.. Is anybody here still using DOS 6.22 so the cell is now destroyed, but that is only one cell. but if there are now components of the hiv virus, how is it assembled? or does the modified cell i've been fascinated by this stuff too long well you're a better biologist than I Gungadin ;p this is the scary thing about viruses. ...assemble the hiv virus. it takes apart the atgc's of the cell dna and reassembles the hiv virus plus, the virus is very very small using the one strand of dna imbedded into the cell dna because it carries nothing but dna does one hiv virus that enters a cell create many hiv viruses? No...not directly... I wonder what was the carrier... was it ever confirmed that it came from Reeses monkeys? hundreds.. maybe thousands.. many many that's bad I'm not sure exactly the number As far as I understand...it uses the other cells in the human body to create itself... yeah yep ...kinda like stealing cpu time on other peoples computers... Uses the Cells Protien Manufacturing parts to make more of itself... but you've got this small virus... and it's copying itself using the workings of a cell's entire genetic code Even if I can't spell... yes it does Ya...what he said... i thought viruses were specific to cell types. they have special hosts they work with. is that not the case? yes that's for infection Ya...what he said... Isn't the thing with HIV that it infects the T cells??? hiv in particular attaches to a certain protien code on the outside of the immune cell Or something like that... hiv works with T cells right but isnt there a word that starts with a C? Hey...I guess high school biology is worth something... a virus is a scary thing to look at a pic of it's a protein coat with a bit of dna or rna in it That takes one heck of a lense... and little strands of protien that look like legs rabies goes to the brain, thats worse to me Hydro Phobia... now the protien coat of the virus is different water fearing? for every type of virus rabies is a bacteria what are examples of other retroviruses? Herpies I thought... hiv , herpes, Clamidia... ummm.... I think... Chlamydia... I don't think that was one of them there arent many mostly anything chronic :) I think your right.... rabies is a virus, infact the first we cured. thanks river :) Now that I think of it that one is curred with anti biotics... it's not a virus then antibiotics only work against bacteria well, thats true but there can be vaccines viruses aren't really alive by the standard definiton Does anybody sitll use DOS 6.22 and Windows 3.1 or 3.11??? nope however, programmers seem to think so, as they always seem to make 3.1 versions of their software :) vaccines alert the immune system ahead of time by introducing a foreign object (harmless) into the bloodstream like smallpox pastuer had the famous case with that child he created a rabies vaccine for. I need a DOS mouse driver for this game and it's not my computer... and thus eventually, the virus is eliminated sorry.. no.. though I did for awhile what virus has been eliminated??? isnt it possible that there are smallpox carriers still existing? there are outbreaks every year thats curious in places like africa from what I read viruses mutate at a very high rate.. it could be another mutation of cowpox its the position of the CDC that the last sample of smallpox is being stored at one of their facilities and there are two samples.. one in the us and one in russion they've got one in Russia too it was supposed to be destroyed or something nope well, it was scheduled to be personally I would say go get a smallpox vaccine if you don't have one whats the significance of the samples if there are still carriers? biowarfare? with the advent of chemical weapons..and the current state of russia (who did have a sample) I'm quite worried that mine is the first generation not to be thoroughly vaccinated your generation? geeze! the only think that allows us to receive the rabies vaccine after we have been bit and still survive is that rabies has an incubation period. after they determined that they had eradicated smallpox from the earth (a false assumption as well) the incubation period is long enough for the vaccine to build up the immune system. they stopped vaccinating people the only reason I have one is because I'm an army brat and it's required why would they think they eliminated smallpox thats rather shortsighted exactly there are very very few cases.. so few that they can attribute it to freak mutation but for all practical purposes.. they have you cannot walk down the street and get smallpox not like you can the flu Is it just me or is there not very many people talking join #philosophy, always talk there (if inane) sorry.. just hit on a topic I know alot about *shrug* :) are you sure rabies is bacteria? dibosa, you seem very knowledgeable about microbiology... hold on let me look it up.. I'm almost positive its a bacteria that would be what I'm planning on doing with the rest of my life... virology and toxicology in particular that is if I survive college :) ...that is why i don't know how to take the fact that you did not know that rabies is a virus. that is very clear and very common knowledge. it is a virus someone saying they could treat it with antibiotics threw me off well you'll never survive college at that rate :) they said that AFTER you said it was a bacteria :) okay I was mistaken if it is a virus it works like all other viruses do and all viruses do have an incubation period but whatever dibosa, are you familiar with how pasteur in his old age came up with a vaccine for rabies. there is the story about the dying boy that was brought to his door step by his mother. no I've never heard it pasteur was smallpox I thought what did he vaccinate? smallpox.. and apparently rabies though I never heard the story Oh...old Louie... pasteur had been working on the vaccine but it was not ready to test. he tried it on himself and then at great personal professional risk, gave it to the boy. ...or do you mean another Pasteur??? louie that boy was his son and I thought that was smallpox ? that boy was not his son. it was a poor boy from another town. ok I thought that was what was daring about it the store has an odd ending... * Maximilli doesn't know...he failed History...or almost.. but o-k the kid dies? no, the smallpox story is about a farmer. completely different so the kid lives and is saved. ummm if the kid was DYING then how the hell would a vaccine work? if he's already suffering effects of the virus.. isn't it too late for the vaccine to have an effect? no, the rabies virus has an incubation period... sweetie, someone was in here looking for you talking much...is Microbiology not your thing... but apparently it wasnt incubating an incubation period is where you feel no effects I thought the mother said he was sick long enough to let the vaccine build up the immune system how did the mom know he was sick if it was incubating? if you're bitten by something that is rabid.. the standard series is twelve shots given once a week he was bit so bad a the dog had rabies, so they knew the boy would die. oh (one shot a week for twelve weeks rather) okay that makes sense then so he had already been working on the vaccine before the bite? the incubation period for rabies is about 15 days anyway, back to the story... I am sure that no vaccine has been created that quickly. he must've been working on it (he was working on it) when did pasteur live/die? in his later years, as the little boy was an old man, he was the one that took care of pasteur's grave, which was quite a thing in france. pasteur was a real hero... I always thought he did that thing with the milk... ;) <_Sweetie> heheh pasteur was just a great guy all around (he did the thing witht he milk too) now, during the war, the germans wanted to destroy the grave site... Okay... and the little boy (now an old man) defended it to his death! <_Sweetie> hmmmm That is really cool...I didn't know that... well, I dont think louie would have condoned that, but.. :) nod.. good story ...I know that happened a lot with libraries... <_Sweetie> thats why I don't want to be burried in that fashion...I think I'd rather be creamated and my ashes tilled into the garden what a world, huh? Any garden in particular...any kind of plant you would want to come back as??? <_Sweetie> oooo good question <_Sweetie> hmmmmm I try... <_Sweetie> as a matter of fact <_Sweetie> I have a favorite tree I imagine the most common answer would be a rose... <_Sweetie> Manzanita It rings a bell...where does it grow??? <_Sweetie> in California! <_Sweetie> hehehe Kwl...I'm seven miles from there... sweetie, dogs with and without rabies would come to visit you in your new life. :) I"m probably going down there tomorrow... ooops...today... <_Sweetie> the barkm which is light grey to brown, peels off naturally to reveal teh dark red underneath Ya...lotsa them here... Especially around the river... <_Sweetie> I LIKE dogs How about Chittum trees...hear of them??? I'm not sure if I spelled that right... <_Sweetie> the tree is sometimes called the Lovers Tree... the red supposed to represent the blood/heart of lovers kwl... <_Sweetie> hehe :) I thought so well (yawn) I'm going to bed..have to pack to go back to school on sunday isn't that the mulberry? <_Sweetie> hmmm not familiar with Chittum trees (lovers tree) <_Sweetie> night dibosa If you ever want to be mean to somebody you make Chittum tea...using the bark... <_Sweetie> what does it do? lets just say somebody with a lisp would say it best... ch...sh.. <_Sweetie> laxative properties? yep * River2_-_ just decided to make some tea. <_Sweetie> heheh Green tea is really good.. <_Sweetie> no chittum tea for me thanks <_Sweetie> Echinacea tea is good <_Sweetie> bummer <_Sweetie> puffee!!!!!! Any special properties??? * _Sweetie tacklehugs ffeee! sweetie! puffee!!!! maximillee!!!!!!!!! * _Sweetie gives puffee a big Hug Don't thing I know you...just didn't want to feel left out... ;) echinacea is marketed as a preemptory cold defense ah okay but its prolly bs we keep leaving poplitics to politicians and science to scientists. ...both dubious...